tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post8114275639912345994..comments2023-12-18T09:55:42.480-08:00Comments on What Sister Never Knew and Father Never Told You: Amoris Laetita: Opening An Even Bigger Door?Unknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger12125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-46414081725382481022016-04-17T18:11:20.492-07:002016-04-17T18:11:20.492-07:00He may also be the poster who has taken another po...He may also be the poster who has taken another poster's name with one tiny modification.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-82038480827477655452016-04-13T06:13:12.790-07:002016-04-13T06:13:12.790-07:00It is funny but I never used the word "consci...It is funny but I never used the word "conscience" in the posting. I think you are just out looking for a quarrel. Now, I am old enough to have done my basic religious education in the years before Vatican II--under good Popes Pius XII and John XXIII. And I clearly remember the good Sisters teaching us that we had to form our consciences in the light of Church teaching but that forming one conscience in consideration of the teaching of the Church was not the same as conforming our conscience to the teaching of the Church. We learned that you had to look deeply and honestly into your own soul and question how the teaching applied--or failed to apply--to you. The example the Sisters gave us was Franz Jaggerstatter, the Austrian conscientious objector who was executed for refusing to serve in the Army of the Third Reich. The Catholic Church had no position at the time on conscientious objectors. Jaggerstatter's priest told him he had a duty to serve both to his nation and so he could provide for his wife and children. Jaggerstatter's bishop told him he had to serve that there was nothing in the teaching of the Church to excuse his military service. But Jaggerstatter believed that it would be wrong and he refused to serve and was martyred for his decision. And of course there was Joan of Arc. A panel of bishops told her her visions were from the devil and pointed out that it was forbidden by the Scriptures for women to wear men's clothing. She refused to conform because her conscience told her differently and she paid the price. Yes, in forming our consciences we must pay close attention to the teaching of the Church, but the ultimate decision of what constitutes moral behavior is ours. So go ahead and judge others as you choose but the safer course is to trust they are acting with a graced integrity unless you know something else to the contrary Consolaminihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09278560268489520757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-83281483993193948172016-04-13T04:58:13.376-07:002016-04-13T04:58:13.376-07:00I saw the Rorate Caeli posting by “Monsieur l’Abbé...I saw the Rorate Caeli posting by “Monsieur l’Abbé” though I hadn’t originally bothered to read it, but I don’t find much dangerous in the article and do find some distress that the “Monsieur l’Abbé” as been entrusted with the cure of souls. I know the type of priest—the affected cleric of a self-chosen pretentious nom de plume who mentally inhabits a world of European aristocracy with its foppish idiosyncrasies. I have been invited to rectories where a coterie of soutane clad clerics gather for their kirs royale before settling down to a multi-course dinner with its bevy of forks to one’s left and a regiment of knives to one’s right and as many as five wine glasses above. And, of course, not a woman in sight—even the people from the caterer’s are all men—and despite the all male presence, a man-eating tiger would starve to death if you know what I mean. Clerical gossip and ecclesiastical fashion are the topics of conversation. One or another will brag about his new cook—“a soufflé for dessert every night, every night. The bishop was coming to dinner weekly until his doctor made him stop.” Another has found a villa in Umbria for two weeks next summer “I just love being so close to Saint Francis…” and never sees the irony. And then these same prelatini will sit in the confessional and give guidance to the mother of five or the man who works two jobs to put his kids through the parish school. No if anything “Monsieur l’Abbé” shows us the need for a serious revaluation of our priests and our candidates for the priesthood. We have many excellent priests who know the faithful entrusted to their care, who can see the everyday challenges to ordinary people, and who can give down to earth spiritual guidance—they have to be the model, not the good “Monsieur l’Abbé.” Consolaminihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09278560268489520757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-32150607141628773012016-04-13T01:25:16.940-07:002016-04-13T01:25:16.940-07:00Here is something to be afraid about.
An American...Here is something to be afraid about.<br /><br />An American contributor, a priest with the pretentious pen-name “Monsieur L’Abbé” has published an essay on <i>Rorate Caeli</i> reading <i>Amoris Laetitia</i> through the lens of <i>Brideshead Revisited</i>. Monsieur considers himself acquainted with the Marchmain family; they are “relatable”, a “family for all seasons”. He is “enthralled with them and back to them often.” He frames the pastoral situations he encounters in terms of Marchmain family members. <br /><br />The essay reads <i>Brideshead</i> on the most superficial level, one that reduces the novel to “good guys” and “bad guys”; worse, every line betrays a dreadful psychological constraint and immaturity on the writer’s part.<br /><br />The gist of it is that Pope Francis would have encouraged Sebastian, Julia, Charles and Lord Marchmain in their sins, rather than confronting them and saving them for heaven.<br /><br />Anyone can write tripe like this essay. Auntie has done so many times. It’s not even that difficult to get rubbish like this published, thanks to the Internet.<br /><br />But here’s what’s truly terrifying: Monsieur is not an aging priest, living out his final years in an Anglophile fantasy. He is (I presume) young and newly ordained, set loose in an American diocese to counsel and guide people whom he reduces to Waugh’s fictional characters. <br /><br />May God have mercy on us all. <br />Auntie Bellumhttp://www.porkchop.netnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-61300073629167759232016-04-12T19:11:35.397-07:002016-04-12T19:11:35.397-07:00Hi, Consolamini,
FrankieB is back as CorvetteKid19...Hi, Consolamini,<br />FrankieB is back as CorvetteKid1969 trying to raise hell at NatCathReporter. Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08530886662019728544noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-76141369886509756212016-04-12T07:59:51.776-07:002016-04-12T07:59:51.776-07:00What do you mean by 'conscience' ? You me...What do you mean by 'conscience' ? You mean the right to disagree with the Church and pretend you are Catholic ? Can a Catholic believe in white superiorty and denigrate blacks ? Is racism tolerated under the "I'm personally opposed to racism but....." argument ?<br /><br />Catholics must form their consciences in accord with Church teaching. Conscience assesses how a person's concrete action in a given situation accords with Church teaching — not to determine whether one agrees with or accepts Church teaching in the first place.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-75471567454447661892016-04-12T02:27:42.237-07:002016-04-12T02:27:42.237-07:00My fear is that younger priests have been so poorl...My fear is that younger priests have been so poorly formed and are so rigid in their outlook that the document won't have the intended impact. Already, the commentary has been mixed and some on the right have decided that Pope Francis really meant living as brother and sister or "spiritual Communion." Our buddy, Cardinal Burke, declared that this obviously wasn't part of the Magisterium and Pope Francis was just writing his reflections on this topic because he was bored. I am afraid that this will not change what happens in many dioceses and parishes one bit. The only thing that I can think of is perhaps the laity will be more active in developing their consciences rather than just obeying. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-42032185077804070582016-04-11T18:45:56.524-07:002016-04-11T18:45:56.524-07:00I always enjoy little kernels I pick up from your ...I always enjoy little kernels I pick up from your posts. This was my favorite today: <br /><i>"Martin Luther posted his list of 95 theses <b>he wanted to debate</b> at the University Church of Wittenberg..."</i>(emphasis added) <br />Why do I like this? Because although it makes perfect sense (the word 'theses' should have been a clue to me) the idea that Luther was seeking academic debate has never been connected for me and I've got a little age on me. So thank you.Ollllddudehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00893625383056639105noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-48094359644354170712016-04-11T17:57:07.409-07:002016-04-11T17:57:07.409-07:00Well, you know I do want to entrust my capital to ...Well, you know I do want to entrust my capital to him--that is my Faith. I have been reading the gospels for half a century now, and in this Pope I hear the voice of the Good Shepherd. O sure, Jesus speaks through each of the popes (at least their varied holinesses let him) but I can recognize the voice of the shepherd when Francis speaks. I know that a lot of people put all sorts of spins on what he says and does. He is too liberal. He hugs gay people, He wears a clown-nose to be funny, He laughs too much, He doesn't genuflect at Mass, he put a beach-ball on the altar at Santa Maria Maggiore. I read it all. But I see the passion he has for migrants. I see the tenderness he shows to the handicapped. I hear him speak honestly about his own faults and failures. I'm sorry you feel different, but I have a pope I can believe in and, more important, a pope I can believe.<br />the day will come when Francis retires or goes to his grave and we will have a new pope. Trust me, it won't be another Francis. Maybe the red shoes will come out again and we might even see him sitting on a throne. Who knows. He will probably be more about Law and Order and less about the environment and economic injustice. And he will be Pope too. I'll live with it I i will miss Francis, but whoever is pope steers the barque and I go along for the ride. Right now I am just grateful for a sail full of wind and a blue sky. Consolaminihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09278560268489520757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-71294386269269266752016-04-11T11:20:50.640-07:002016-04-11T11:20:50.640-07:00Consolamini, I DO like Francis -- personally. But...Consolamini, I DO like Francis -- personally. But I look at who elected him to Pope and their secret (and not-so-secret) agenda and I see moral decay. I've been reading your blog for a few weeks now and I have yet to see you say anything bad about the state of the Catholic Church in all these "liberal" Cardinals dioceses. <br /><br />Are you aware that Mass attendance used to be 80% in these countries ? And now its down to single-digits ? You don't see cause-and-effect there ?<br /><br />Religion in general and Catholicism in particular are belief systems predicated on a Higher Being. Strip away the underlying rationale for that belief, and it all collapses. There are better social clubs with better benefits than a church if all you want to do is hang out.<br /><br />I see nothing in Pope Francis' message about salvation or saving souls. I hear him wanting people to come back to the Catholic Church -- WHY ?? <br /><br />So they can feel good about themselves ?<br /><br />So they will change their behavior ?<br /><br />So they won't feel left out ?<br /><br />So they will stop engaging in their sinful behavior ?<br /><br />What is the end game here, Consolamini ? Does Pope Francis think Anglicanism or Episcopalianism is the way to go ? Lutheranism, where they have already started to split like the As and Es ?<br /><br />Have you researched what Francis did to the Church in Argentina ? It's not exactly inspiring confidence in those of us who studied his past. Doesn't make him a bad person, anymore than a failed businessman is a bad person. <br /><br />Just means you don't want to entrust him with your capital -- or Faith.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-88509693474438950752016-04-11T10:36:26.178-07:002016-04-11T10:36:26.178-07:00Well, I am sorry that you don't like Francis a...Well, I am sorry that you don't like Francis and where he is taking the Church, but your "tolerating personal sin and elevating public policies into Good vs Evil" is a characterization of Francis' agenda and one that clearly reveals your biases. I am afraid that you are going to grow only more and more unhappy in his remaining tenure but take comfort in the thought that his successor will almost certainly reflect a swing of the pendulum, though to what degree it is hard to say. The pre-conclave meetings of the Cardinals will be fascinating as they debate out these policies and where the Church should go. Consolaminihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09278560268489520757noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1900800634479346046.post-33334301242345696062016-04-11T10:05:01.069-07:002016-04-11T10:05:01.069-07:00Back on track ? You mean by tolerating personal s...Back on track ? You mean by tolerating personal sin and elevating social and public policies into Good vs. Evil, like Laudato Si ? Gee, no Christian church has ever dumped moral values and elevated social justice nonsense to the highest order. I am sure it is a prescription for moral, theological, and attendance success. Let's just call AL "Lambeth II."<br /><br />I also like how every DRM was formerly in an 'abusive' marriage. I have yet to see someone say "I just got tired of the guy/gal, and thought I could do better." Yes, I am sure that never has happened in all of time memorial.<br /><br />Why not call this the Catholics vs. the Protestants, instead of conservatives vs. progressives ? Because you would be hard-pressed to tell me where the regressives differ from Protestnatism, that is to say Liberal Protestantism, in their theology or moral beliefs. Not surprisingly, all of these regressives are from Western Europe where the Church has been destroyed.<br /><br />And that's who you want guiding us into the future? God Help Us.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com